On Thu, Apr 24, 2014 at 11:07 PM, K7VE - John k7ve@k7ve.org wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages) _______________________________________________ Don,
John,
You are missing the whole point
Not at all.
- Not everyone needs to run BGP, or
have a datacenter, they just need to find a border node who does and VPN/Tunnel to it. It's called cooperation.
Actually, unless this is agreed upon by everyone, this is just an idea. Not cooperation. Cooperation requires that all parties are willing to accept to the terms and conditions which many have been against.
Those who can provide a BGP border node,
This alone raises the bar for many people beyond those of normal radio operators.
can 'advertise' through this
list or portal.ampr.org that fact
and how to get setup to tunnel/VPN
to them.
Isn't that encap.txt? :)
I digress... it still requires a sharing of configurations, secrets and certificates depending on type of tunnel being built. We were talking about DMVPN earlier so that was the example I used.
Like I said some of these routers have 'unlimited' support for VPN/Tunnel clients. You can also tier this architecture. A single border router might be supporting 20 /16 VPNs/Tunnels to tier 2 routers, those routers might support 30 smaller subnets and so on ---
You don't need to sell me... I'm covered for networking gear. Maybe the next startup I ride into the ground will net me a Cisco Nexus. ;)
There are some peering points that are relatively inexpensive (or free) and some individuals are in a position to be generous.
Yes. But I was speaking of others in other parts of the world not here on the west coast where it's not the case. We shouldn't be so myopic in our world view to not consider those cases.
This is no different than the FM repeater operator who pays for a site, equipment, and power costs to benefit a community of users, who may or may not make donations to that cost.
Granted. But usually the repeater is operated by a club or group. And if you feel aligned with them or at least willing to smile to their jokes, by all means, sign up. However, the ones that aren't joiners should still get access to the same spectrum at the same level. After all, "nobody owns a frequency", even if you are trying to raise the bar to where it becomes a game of the biggest wallet.
Right now the total traffic on 44net could probably ride on a single home broadband connection.
Until you require everyone to go through your bottleneck... then it no longer is that. And like you mention, the goal is to make it completely available onto the internet.
I run my personal /24 (non-44net) over a VPN 24x7 and have several hosts, including D-STAR gateways running over it.
I got one of those setups as well personally not to mention what I do professionally.
But what I'm suggesting is that we shouldn't turn 44net into a class system of haves and have nots. The ones who have the ability to advertise their subnets are the haves and the ones who are forced to go through a gateway are the have nots. The network should just be how it is.... chaotic. The only improvement I would recommend is GRE instead of IPIP. Beyond that, leave it as it is.
People will want to interconnect or they won't. But it shouldn't be contingent upon anyone but themselves.