Can someone please direct me to the right place where I can purchase a complete kit so that I can setup an IP Ham network system. I would like to experiment with using using the 44Net as a fall back network in times of disaster.
Any assistance / direction will be very appreciated as I am new at this.
Thanks
Arnold Villeneuve
www.networkologist.com http://www.networkologist.com
Change is the end result of all true learning.- Leo Buscaglia
Since you have not posted any callsign, I assume you are not a ham radio operator...
-----Original Message----- From: Arnold@rogers Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 23:47 To: 44Net@hamradio.ucsd.edu Subject: [44net] Looking for assistance setting up IP Ham system
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages) _______________________________________________ Can someone please direct me to the right place where I can purchase a complete kit so that I can setup an IP Ham network system. I would like to experiment with using using the 44Net as a fall back network in times of disaster.
Any assistance / direction will be very appreciated as I am new at this.
Thanks
Arnold Villeneuve
www.networkologist.com http://www.networkologist.com
Change is the end result of all true learning.- Leo Buscaglia
Not yet but I am studying for the exam and plan to pass this summer.
Sent from my iPhone
On May 31, 2016, at 5:55 PM, Marius Petrescu marius@yo2loj.ro wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages) _______________________________________________ Since you have not posted any callsign, I assume you are not a ham radio operator...
-----Original Message----- From: Arnold@rogers Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 23:47 To: 44Net@hamradio.ucsd.edu Subject: [44net] Looking for assistance setting up IP Ham system
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages) _______________________________________________ Can someone please direct me to the right place where I can purchase a complete kit so that I can setup an IP Ham network system. I would like to experiment with using using the 44Net as a fall back network in times of disaster.
Any assistance / direction will be very appreciated as I am new at this.
Thanks
Arnold Villeneuve
www.networkologist.com http://www.networkologist.com
Change is the end result of all true learning.- Leo Buscaglia
On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 06:03:10PM -0400, Arnold Villeneuve wrote:
Can someone please direct me to the right place where I can purchase a complete kit so that I can setup an IP Ham network system. I would like to experiment with using using the 44Net as a fall back network in times of disaster.
Arnold, as far as I know, no such complete kit exists. - Brian
Also what type of system are you looking for, bands/speed/usage?
On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 3:09 PM, Brian Kantor Brian@ucsd.edu wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages) _______________________________________________ On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 06:03:10PM -0400, Arnold Villeneuve wrote:
Can someone please direct me to the right place where I can purchase a complete kit so that I can setup an IP Ham network system. I would like
to
experiment with using using the 44Net as a fall back network in times of disaster.
Arnold, as far as I know, no such complete kit exists. - Brian
44Net mailing list 44Net@hamradio.ucsd.edu http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
I guess my default answer would be in the upper bandwidth range.
I know networking for servers and PCs very well and have been doing integration for but IP over Ham is totally new to me so I am trying to learn as much as possible from the experts.
Thank you for any and all advice.
Sent from my iPhone
On May 31, 2016, at 6:13 PM, K7VE - John k7ve@k7ve.org wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages) _______________________________________________ Also what type of system are you looking for, bands/speed/usage?
On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 3:09 PM, Brian Kantor Brian@ucsd.edu wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages) _______________________________________________
On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 06:03:10PM -0400, Arnold Villeneuve wrote: Can someone please direct me to the right place where I can purchase a complete kit so that I can setup an IP Ham network system. I would like
to
experiment with using using the 44Net as a fall back network in times of disaster.
Arnold, as far as I know, no such complete kit exists. - Brian
44Net mailing list 44Net@hamradio.ucsd.edu http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
--
John D. Hays K7VE PO Box 1223, Edmonds, WA 98020-1223 http://k7ve.org/blog http://twitter.com/#!/john_hays http://www.facebook.com/john.d.hays
On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 3:18 PM, Arnold Villeneuve < arnold.villeneuve@rogers.com> wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages) _______________________________________________ I guess my default answer would be in the upper bandwidth range.
I know networking for servers and PCs very well and have been doing integration for but IP over Ham is totally new to me so I am trying to learn as much as possible from the experts.
Thank you for any and all advice.
Your IP Networking experience should carry over. Depending on your national requirements, you can't use Ham for any business/commercial purpose (there are some exceptions in an emergency).
IP on ham radio varies from very low data rate < 1200 baud to megabits.
Here is one high performance implementation. It includes equipment recommendations http://hamwan.org/t/Wiki+Home+Page
On 5/31/16 6:26 PM, K7VE - John wrote:
Here is one high performance implementation. It includes equipment recommendations http://hamwan.org/t/Wiki+Home+Page
Sorry for being late to the conversation, but here are the slides from my talk on just this at Dayton 2016.
http://keekles.org/~bryan/2016%20Ham%20radio%20networking%20dayton.pptx
Video was taken of it, but it's not up yet.
Also what jurisdiction/location are you in? That's going to play quite a bit into the licensing and what bands you can use. Looks like you might be .ca, which depending on the area might be a good thing.
73's
Sorry for being late to the conversation, but here are the slides from my talk on just this at Dayton 2016.
http://keekles.org/~bryan/2016%20Ham%20radio%20networking%20dayton.pptx
Video was taken of it, but it's not up yet.
The TAPR HamWAN talk? That's in the HamRadioNow video starting at something like minute 42. Watched it yesterday.. Well done.
Bill, WA7NWP
On 6/1/16 11:55 AM, Bill Vodall wrote:
The TAPR HamWAN talk? That's in the HamRadioNow video starting at something like minute 42. Watched it yesterday.. Well done.
Link?
I didn't' know it was up yet.
http://www.hamradionow.tv/episodes/
On Wed, Jun 1, 2016 at 9:17 AM, Bryan Fields Bryan@bryanfields.net wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages) _______________________________________________ On 6/1/16 11:55 AM, Bill Vodall wrote:
The TAPR HamWAN talk? That's in the HamRadioNow video starting at something like minute 42. Watched it yesterday.. Well done.
Link?
I didn't' know it was up yet.
-- Bryan Fields
727-409-1194 - Voice 727-214-2508 - Fax http://bryanfields.net _________________________________________ 44Net mailing list 44Net@hamradio.ucsd.edu http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
On Wed, Jun 1, 2016 at 8:55 AM, Bill Vodall wa7nwp@gmail.com wrote:
The TAPR HamWAN talk? That's in the HamRadioNow video starting at something like minute 42. Watched it yesterday.. Well done.
Bill, WA7NWP
Here's a direct link: https://youtu.be/IFcESjoWSP8?t=2520
Tom KD7LXL
On 6/1/16 12:31 PM, Tom Hayward wrote:
On Wed, Jun 1, 2016 at 8:55 AM, Bill Vodall wa7nwp@gmail.com wrote:
The TAPR HamWAN talk? That's in the HamRadioNow video starting at something like minute 42. Watched it yesterday.. Well done.
Bill, WA7NWP
Here's a direct link: https://youtu.be/IFcESjoWSP8?t=2520
Thanks! Lighting is horrid, and I got rushed at the end :(
Hello Arnold,
Though your network background will significantly help you come up to speed, there is a lot of unique nuances to amateur radio centric networking. This is one the fun parts of the hobby (to me) so I would encourage you do build up your own system and not try to buy something already build for you. . Much of the systems everyone here uses are is homebrewed with Linux machines, old Wifi routers, etc. Some of it can use modern over the shelf HW from say Mikrotik, Ubiquiti, etc. Some things to ponder:
- Packet radio using AX.25 (not TCP/IP) speeds range from 300baud on HF to 19.2K+ on VHF - Personal favorite of mine and feel very similar to the dialup BBSes from days past. A computer + soundcard (or a HW TNC) + radio will get you on the air. I personally run the Direwolf software based TNC on Centos Linux. This is the same foundation that runs APRS
- AMPR IPIP tunneling networks - that's this group which creates and maintains a fully meshed network of IPIP protocol "VPNS". Other HAMs offer IPSEC based VPNs as an alternative to the IPIP system Many of these networks are created via either Linux machines or BBS applications running on Linux -Jnos and other NOS systems (network operating systems). AMPR 44/8 routes are propagated either via BGP, a customized version of RIP, or a static routes list that can be scripted to update your system's route table.
- Broadband HamNet / HSMM - Wifi mesh networking using select legacy Wifi APs (Linksys, etc) but also supports select modern Ubiquti APs for very fast IP networking assuming you have nearby peers to work with
Ultimately, you won't learn all the details and nuances that makes up these technologies if you just "buy it". You need to build it to learn it. To start your education, start here:
http://wiki.ampr.org/wiki/Main_Page
Beyond that, this is the right group to talk about AMPR related networking and I'm sure lots of people here can extensively talk about some of the points above as well.
--David KI6ZHD
Thank you. I take your advice seriously and will follow up on your recommendations.
I love to build computers and networks and that's how I started in 1982 so what you are suggesting only makes sense. But as you know it is generally a steep hill to climb :-) But if that what it takes, that is what it takes.
One of the things I am working with a lot lately is mini ARM computers like Raspberry Pi and Odroid so I will be interested in seeing how I can apply these units to the IP HAM networking mix as they have more than enough power and are very Linux friendly.
Thanks again for your advice and recommendations. I appreciate it sincerely.
Change is the end result of all true learning.- Leo Buscaglia
-----Original Message----- From: 44Net [mailto:44net-bounces+arnold.villeneuve=rogers.com@hamradio.ucsd.edu] On Behalf Of David Ranch Sent: May-31-16 6:50 PM To: AMPRNet working group Subject: Re: [44net] Looking for assistance setting up IP Ham system
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages) _______________________________________________
Hello Arnold,
Though your network background will significantly help you come up to speed, there is a lot of unique nuances to amateur radio centric networking. This is one the fun parts of the hobby (to me) so I would encourage you do build up your own system and not try to buy something already build for you. . Much of the systems everyone here uses are is homebrewed with Linux machines, old Wifi routers, etc. Some of it can use modern over the shelf HW from say Mikrotik, Ubiquiti, etc. Some things to ponder:
- Packet radio using AX.25 (not TCP/IP) speeds range from 300baud on HF to 19.2K+ on VHF - Personal favorite of mine and feel very similar to the dialup BBSes from days past. A computer + soundcard (or a HW TNC) + radio will get you on the air. I personally run the Direwolf software based TNC on Centos Linux. This is the same foundation that runs APRS
- AMPR IPIP tunneling networks - that's this group which creates and maintains a fully meshed network of IPIP protocol "VPNS". Other HAMs offer IPSEC based VPNs as an alternative to the IPIP system Many of these networks are created via either Linux machines or BBS applications running on Linux -Jnos and other NOS systems (network operating systems). AMPR 44/8 routes are propagated either via BGP, a customized version of RIP, or a static routes list that can be scripted to update your system's route table.
- Broadband HamNet / HSMM - Wifi mesh networking using select legacy Wifi APs (Linksys, etc) but also supports select modern Ubiquti APs for very fast IP networking assuming you have nearby peers to work with
Ultimately, you won't learn all the details and nuances that makes up these technologies if you just "buy it". You need to build it to learn it. To start your education, start here:
http://wiki.ampr.org/wiki/Main_Page
Beyond that, this is the right group to talk about AMPR related networking and I'm sure lots of people here can extensively talk about some of the points above as well.
--David KI6ZHD
Direwolf is a very cool packet radio modem and you can use it with your Raspberry Pi.
I'm involved with NW Digital Radio and just put together a little wiki on using direwolf with a UDRC on Raspberry Pi
https://nw-digital-radio.groups.io/g/udrc/wiki/UDRC%E2%84%A2-and-Direwolf-Pa...
On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 4:06 PM, Arnold@rogers <arnold.villeneuve@rogers.com
wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages) _______________________________________________ Thank you. I take your advice seriously and will follow up on your recommendations.
I love to build computers and networks and that's how I started in 1982 so what you are suggesting only makes sense. But as you know it is generally a steep hill to climb :-) But if that what it takes, that is what it takes.
One of the things I am working with a lot lately is mini ARM computers like Raspberry Pi and Odroid so I will be interested in seeing how I can apply these units to the IP HAM networking mix as they have more than enough power and are very Linux friendly.
Thanks again for your advice and recommendations. I appreciate it sincerely.
--
------------------------------ John D. Hays K7VE PO Box 1223, Edmonds, WA 98020-1223 http://k7ve.org/blog http://twitter.com/#!/john_hays http://www.facebook.com/john.d.hays
On 1.6.2016. 00:49, David Ranch wrote:
Though your network background will significantly help you come up to speed, there is a lot of unique nuances to amateur radio centric networking. This is one the fun parts of the hobby (to me) so I would encourage you do build up your own system and not try to buy something already build for you. .
There is just small problem: 44Networking is quite complex and it is not easy to self learn from scratch, especially when (scarse) documentation and help available assumes you are already an expert.
Some functional starting point can be of great help for people who want to get involved. It is much easier to learn when you have something that works and you can play with.
Pedja YT9TP
Pedja et al,
I've written many documents and tools to help others understand 44-net routing as have Hessu, Marius, and others. It's all out there if you seek. I also wrote the wiki on using the portal to get your ip (block). If something is missing for your desired method of getting 44-net routing there's plenty here on the list that I'm sure will be able to guide you on where you need to go.
If there's a specific device you'll be using, there's documents available. If you can't find it, just ask. I've personally helped many get on amprnet.
--- Pardon my brevity, I'm on a Samsung Galaxy smartphone. --- Sent via axMail-Fax by N1URO.
On June 1, 2016 2:33:28 AM Pedja YT9TP yt9tp@uzice.net wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages) _______________________________________________
On 1.6.2016. 00:49, David Ranch wrote:
Though your network background will significantly help you come up to speed, there is a lot of unique nuances to amateur radio centric networking. This is one the fun parts of the hobby (to me) so I would encourage you do build up your own system and not try to buy something already build for you. .
There is just small problem: 44Networking is quite complex and it is not easy to self learn from scratch, especially when (scarse) documentation and help available assumes you are already an expert.
Some functional starting point can be of great help for people who want to get involved. It is much easier to learn when you have something that works and you can play with.
Pedja YT9TP
44Net mailing list 44Net@hamradio.ucsd.edu http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
And that's kind of what I was hoping for.
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 1, 2016, at 2:32 AM, Pedja YT9TP yt9tp@uzice.net wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages) _______________________________________________
On 1.6.2016. 00:49, David Ranch wrote: Though your network background will significantly help you come up to speed, there is a lot of unique nuances to amateur radio centric networking. This is one the fun parts of the hobby (to me) so I would encourage you do build up your own system and not try to buy something already build for you. .
There is just small problem: 44Networking is quite complex and it is not easy to self learn from scratch, especially when (scarse) documentation and help available assumes you are already an expert.
Some functional starting point can be of great help for people who want to get involved. It is much easier to learn when you have something that works and you can play with.
Pedja YT9TP
44Net mailing list 44Net@hamradio.ucsd.edu http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
Hello Arnold,
As you mentioned you've been playing around with ARM based platforms (Raspberry Pi, Odroid, etc), check out the "Hal Digital" project:
https://sourceforge.net/projects/haldigital/
This older Rpi image (Raspbian Wheezy based for a Rpi2 ) has a graphical TUI to take users through configuring the Linux AX.25 stack and bring up the FBB BBS and the URO node. It has all of the foundation pieces for an AMPR setup as well. I've been meaning to work on a new Rasbian Jessie with an Rpi v3 image and merge it with my Rpi v2 hardening doc: http://www.trinityos.com/HAM/CentosDigitalModes/RPi/rpi2-setup.txt but a lack of time has been hurting that. You can try to take the HAL scripts and run them on a Jessie image though and I bet it will work for 90%+ of the items (the other 10% might be different due to SystemD specific settings.
Give it a try and if you don't like it.. just wipe out the microSD card and try something else.
--David KI6ZHD
-
Arnold Villeneuve -
Arnold＠rogers
-
Bill Vodall -
Brian -
Brian Kantor -
Bryan Fields -
David Ranch -
K7VE - John -
Marius Petrescu -
Pedja YT9TP -
Tom Hayward