I don't use the e-mail client to "reply". I have set the list to digest mode, the daily digests I move to a separate folder that effectively is a trashcan, and I read the topics via the mailman archive site where I cut and paste parts into a new mail message every time. So no threads from me.
I don't like mailing lists. At ALL. Precisely because thread management is so difficult, uninteresting threads cannot be killed, and traffic comes in between normal mail. I would propose setting up a small USENET server with one or a couple of groups and then use a newsreader to read and reply to the threads.
But that is apparently considered old-fashioned as well by some, and newer methods are considered unacceptable.
So, no change. Live with it. Make a processing rule in your mailclient that dumps the 44net mail in a separate folder, so your Inbox is left clean.
Rob
On 9/9/17 6:45 AM, Rob Janssen wrote:
I don't use the e-mail client to "reply". I have set the list to digest mode, the daily digests I move to a separate folder that effectively is a trashcan, and I read the topics via the mailman archive site where I cut and paste parts into a new mail message every time. So no threads from me.
Then you need to add a References: and In-Reply-To: header to your "replies".
On 9/09/2017 8:45 PM, Rob Janssen wrote:
So, no change. Live with it. Make a processing rule in your mailclient that dumps the 44net mail in a separate folder, so your Inbox is left clean.
I do this with all of my mailing lists. Works like a charm. :) As for different methods of communication, I do already use Facebook - has its pros and cons. The other alternative is a web forum - no thanks, I hate those things, their interfaces are generally slow and clumsy for me. I think leaving it as a mailing list is the best compromise. :)
So you're deliberately making things worse for others because they didn't choose what you wanted. I don't know how it is in your place but in mine it's called being a dick.
And BTW - I do have a separate email account just for mailing lists but it's still unreadable when you have 15 threads instead of one.
If you think it clutters your inbox - do as you said - make a folder and filter. If you want to mute a thread - there are plugins for that to i.e. Thunderbird.
And argh, on other lists I'm subscribed to even non technical persons are able to properly use the thread system - why is it so hard to do this here where people should represent something more?
I'm not voting for changing the tool. I'm voting for not misusing the things we already have.
-- All the best Paweł
Rob Janssen wrote:
I don't use the e-mail client to "reply". I have set the list to digest mode, the daily digests I move to a separate folder that effectively is a trashcan, and I read the topics via the mailman archive site where I cut and paste parts into a new mail message every time. So no threads from me.
I don't like mailing lists. At ALL. Precisely because thread management is so difficult, uninteresting threads cannot be killed, and traffic comes in between normal mail. I would propose setting up a small USENET server with one or a couple of groups and then use a newsreader to read and reply to the threads.
But that is apparently considered old-fashioned as well by some, and newer methods are considered unacceptable.
So, no change. Live with it. Make a processing rule in your mailclient that dumps the 44net mail in a separate folder, so your Inbox is left clean.
Rob _________________________________________ 44Net mailing list 44Net@hamradio.ucsd.edu http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
On 9/15/2017 4:35 AM, pidpawel wrote:
And argh, on other lists I'm subscribed to even non technical persons are able to properly use the thread system - why is it so hard to do this here where people should represent something more?
The problem is that many readers get the "Digest" version of this list, which means that they don't have any easy way to respond to a post from a digest, without breaking the threading info that needs to be included in the reply's headers. I moderate such a list myself, and I have found out that it's difficult for the moderator or list owner to add such info.
I recommend that those who read the "digest" version of the list consider signing up with a Google Groups or similar ID, so that they can reply to individual posts from the Google Groups web page. It's a far from ideal, but a workable solution: whatever you think about being monitored and tracked, nobody has ever called me up and tried to sell me a new transceiver, antenna, or AX.25 software.
FWIW. YMMV.
Bill, W4EWH
On 9/15/17 10:59 AM, Bill Horne wrote:
The problem is that many readers get the "Digest" version of this list, which means that they don't have any easy way to respond to a post from a digest, without breaking the threading info that needs to be included in the reply's headers.
This is rather easy, and incumbent on the digest users.
1. In your list preferences, "Get MIME or Plain Text Digests?" needs to be set to MIME.
2. In the digest now you will have a link to click on as a reply. The format of this link will be:
mailto:44net@hamradio.ucsd.edu?Subject=SOME-SUBJECT&In-Reply-To=MESSAGE-ID
The &In-Reply-To= will set the message ID that you're responding to.
You can also do this from the archives http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/private/44net/2017-September/008193.html
To reply to the thread, click on the "w6rz at comcast.net" link and it will work just the same. You will need to copy and past as a quote the relevant parts of the thread.
I moderate such a list myself, and I have found out that it's difficult for the moderator or list owner to add such info.
If someone wishes to make their life easier, they damn well better not make mine harder.
I've subscribed to the 44net list as a digest to verify this. One thing of note is the MIME option is not enabled by default, and this should be.
Data point: of the 700 subscribers to the 44net list, 200 are receiving the digest version, and as of a few hours ago, NONE of those have selected the MIME version according to the Mailman list-members utility. I'd have thought a few would be. There is no way to tell how many (if any) may have tried MIME and have returned to the plain (non-MIME) digest version.
I believe some mail readers have the ability to unpack a non-MIME digest but I couldn't name which ones they are off-hand. - Brian
On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 11:29:34AM -0400, Bryan Fields wrote:
I've subscribed to the 44net list as a digest to verify this. One thing of note is the MIME option is not enabled by default, and this should be.
On 9/15/17 11:44 AM, Brian Kantor wrote:
Data point: of the 700 subscribers to the 44net list, 200 are receiving the digest version, and as of a few hours ago, NONE of those have selected the MIME version according to the Mailman list-members utility.
Yea, it needs to be setup as a default; you select digest, you get MIME by default. Change it back if you prefer plain text.
I'd have thought a few would be. There is no way to tell how many (if any) may have tried MIME and have returned to the plain (non-MIME) digest version.
My experience has shown it needs to be a default, and it "just works" for 99% of the people. Few users are using Mutt/pine/etc. and those who are know how to reply to a list properly.
I know thunderbird, eudora and kmail handle it fine.
I'm not sure how outlook handles it, but no one expects outlook lusers to participate on a mailing list without issue.
I believe some mail readers have the ability to unpack a non-MIME digest but I couldn't name which ones they are off-hand.
The plain text version loses the meta-data, and is really not intended to be anything other than a passive view of the list.
I think you have a valid point; I have changed the config so that people choosing 'digest' will get the MIME version unless they select plain.
That's new subscribers only; it won't change the selection for people already subscribed. They can do that themselves. - Brian
On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 11:52:54AM -0400, Bryan Fields wrote:
Yea, it needs to be setup as a default; you select digest, you get MIME by default. Change it back if you prefer plain text. [...] My experience has shown it needs to be a default, and it "just works" for 99% of the people. Few users are using Mutt/pine/etc. and those who are know how to reply to a list properly.
I know thunderbird, eudora and kmail handle it fine.
-
Bill Horne -
Brian Kantor -
Bryan Fields -
pidpawel -
Rob Janssen -
Tony Langdon