9 Jan
2016
9 Jan
'16
9:11 p.m.
While using LOTW certificates is quite ingenious, I think the whole
process to extract the keys will be a big hangup for the less
technical folks.
It really needs to be as easy as possible, like how you can use you
facebook login (oauth token) to log into other sites.
Basically it your ARRL login should work like that, so you can login
to the ampr portal, qrz, etc.
10 Jan
10 Jan
4:46 a.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
On 10.1.2016. 03:11, Steve L wrote:
While using LOTW certificates is quite ingenious, I
think the whole
process to extract the keys will be a big hangup for the less
technical folks.
I could not agree more. Certificates are fine feature but very
cumbersome for people who are not game players.
And certificates expire after three years so everything has to be done
again, and guess what happens if one forgets to renew certificate.
It really needs to be as easy as possible, like how you can use you
facebook login (oauth token) to log into other sites.
Basically it your ARRL login should work like that, so you can login
to the ampr portal, qrz, etc.
This is actually good idea. Making login service could at least simplify
things as you have to deal with certificate at one place only.
This could even be service independent of ARRL, just using LOTW
certificates.
Pedja
YT9TP
---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
9:59 a.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
There seems to be some confusion here. The discussion was never about
verifying the identities of coordinators.
The original suggestion was that there was a way to bypass simple
address assignment by automating the process.
I explained at the time that the coordinators perform a valuable service
that can't be automated in any practical way.
In fact, many coordinators do far more than assign addresses - they
consult with users and provide assistance in getting their stations on
the net. Many of the people currently using AMPRNet would not have been
able to do so without the help of their local coordinator.
I think the coordinators, many of whom have been performing that service
for years, deserve a round of thanks from the community. They certainly
have my appreciation for their hard work and dedication.
- Brian
10:56 a.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
I second that...
-----Original Message-----
From: 44Net [mailto:44net-bounces+lpernot=magma.ca@hamradio.ucsd.edu] On
Behalf Of Brian Kantor
Sent: January 10, 2016 9:59 AM
To: AMPRNet working group
Subject: Re: [44net] Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
There seems to be some confusion here. The discussion was never about
verifying the identities of coordinators.
The original suggestion was that there was a way to bypass simple address
assignment by automating the process.
I explained at the time that the coordinators perform a valuable service
that can't be automated in any practical way.
In fact, many coordinators do far more than assign addresses - they consult
with users and provide assistance in getting their stations on the net.
Many of the people currently using AMPRNet would not have been able to do so
without the help of their local coordinator.
I think the coordinators, many of whom have been performing that service for
years, <<<deserve a round of thanks from the community. They certainly have
my appreciation for their hard work and dedication.>>>
- Brian
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
12:40 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Thank you Brian for those kind words
and also for the work you do and your team in the background support
for the past 25+ years
paul g4apl
In message <20160110145927.GA32116(a)UCSD.Edu>du>, Brian Kantor
<Brian(a)UCSD.Edu> writes
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
There seems to be some confusion here. The discussion was never about
verifying the identities of coordinators.
The original suggestion was that there was a way to bypass simple
address assignment by automating the process.
I explained at the time that the coordinators perform a valuable service
that can't be automated in any practical way.
In fact, many coordinators do far more than assign addresses - they
consult with users and provide assistance in getting their stations on
the net. Many of the people currently using AMPRNet would not have been
able to do so without the help of their local coordinator.
I think the coordinators, many of whom have been performing that service
for years, deserve a round of thanks from the community. They certainly
have my appreciation for their hard work and dedication.
- Brian
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
--
paul(a)skywaves.demon.co.uk
2:58 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
I echo your words Paul.
On Sun, 2016-01-10 at 17:40 +0000, Paul Lewis wrote:
Thank you Brian for those kind words
and also for the work you do and your team in the background support
for the past 25+ years
While I'm not against automated dishing out of subnets, many of them
either never come up or don't last very long due to various factors
(boredom, lack of knowledge and afraid to ask for assistance for
example). There would need to be a way to determine if auto-allocated
blocks are active and alive so the blocks that are dead go back into the
pool. Of course a downfall of this would be false-positives that a block
isn't live.
73 de Brian - N1URO
email: (see above)
Web: http://www.n1uro.net/
Ampr1: http://n1uro.ampr.org/
Ampr2: http://nos.n1uro.ampr.org
Linux Amateur Radio Services
axMail-Fax & URONode
http://uronode.sourceforge.net
http://axmail.sourceforge.net
AmprNet coordinator for:
Connecticut, Delaware, Maine,
Maryland, Massachusetts,
New Hampshire, Pennsylvania,
Rhode Island, and Vermont.
12 Jan
12 Jan
midnight
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
seconded!
On 16-01-10 01:40 PM, Paul Lewis wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
Thank you Brian for those kind words
and also for the work you do and your team in the background support
for the past 25+ years
paul g4apl
In message <20160110145927.GA32116(a)UCSD.Edu>du>, Brian Kantor
<Brian(a)UCSD.Edu> writes
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
There seems to be some confusion here. The discussion was never about
verifying the identities of coordinators.
The original suggestion was that there was a way to bypass simple
address assignment by automating the process.
I explained at the time that the coordinators perform a valuable service
that can't be automated in any practical way.
In fact, many coordinators do far more than assign addresses - they
consult with users and provide assistance in getting their stations on
the net. Many of the people currently using AMPRNet would not have been
able to do so without the help of their local coordinator.
I think the coordinators, many of whom have been performing that service
for years, deserve a round of thanks from the community. They certainly
have my appreciation for their hard work and dedication.
- Brian
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
1:13 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
With all the discussion about Coordinators... And I do realize this was
never about ID'ing Coordinators..
I have no issues if a list of regional coordinators was maintained on the
reflector. Listing States covered and an email.
I realize the system sends each coordinator an automatic email when requests
are made for their assigned area.. But as I have done over the years.. I
have changed ISP's or Careers and forgot to update my email with certain
systems..
What I also have found.. Is when someone asks me directly for an IP
Address.. And they know who I am . I usually get to work directly with them
on their station setup.. and or Gateway etc...
Just my 2 Cents..
Back to the portal.. Spending a few minutes looking over things..
Unfortunately IP requests and such are so rare I often forget how to until I
either spend some time re-learning or asking..
-----Original Message-----
From: 44Net
[mailto:44net-bounces+n9lya=uronode.n9lya.ampr.org@hamradio.ucsd.edu] On
Behalf Of ve1jot
Sent: Tuesday, January 12, 2016 12:00 AM
To: AMPRNet working group <44net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu>
Subject: Re: [44net] Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
seconded!
On 16-01-10 01:40 PM, Paul Lewis wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
Thank you Brian for those kind words
and also for the work you do and your team in the background support
for the past 25+ years paul g4apl In message
<20160110145927.GA32116(a)UCSD.Edu>du>, Brian Kantor <Brian(a)UCSD.Edu>
writes
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
There seems to be some confusion here. The discussion was never
about verifying the identities of coordinators.
The original suggestion was that there was a way to bypass simple
address assignment by automating the process.
I explained at the time that the coordinators perform a valuable
service that can't be automated in any practical way.
In fact, many coordinators do far more than assign addresses - they
consult with users and provide assistance in getting their stations
on the net. Many of the people currently using AMPRNet would not
have been able to do so without the help of their local coordinator.
I think the coordinators, many of whom have been performing that
service for years, deserve a round of thanks from the community.
They certainly have my appreciation for their hard work and dedication.
- Brian
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
1:28 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
I have no problem sharing my contact information as the NY State coordinator.
We cover the 44.68/16 range that is split up as subnets for each of the 62
counties. Subnets are set aside for regular packet messaging networks and
other subnets in each county are set up for experimentation for other ham
projects like VoIP, etc. I make contact with each request for an allocation
and help them think of how to build out their project for future use.
On Tue, January 12, 2016 1:13 pm, Jerry Kutche (N9LYA) wrote:
With all the discussion about Coordinators... And I do
realize this was
never about ID'ing Coordinators.. I have no issues if a list of regional
coordinators was maintained on the reflector. Listing States covered and an
email.
--
Charles J. Hargrove - N2NOV
NYC ARECS/RACES Citywide Radio Officer/Skywarn Coord.
NYC-ARECS/RACES Net Mon. @ 8:30PM 147.360/107.2 PL
http://www.nyc-arecs.org and http://www.nyc-skywarn.org
NY-NBEMS Net Saturdays @ 10AM & USeast-NBEMS Net Wednesdays @ 7PM
on 7.036 Mhz USB/1500 hz waterfall spot; Olivia 8/500 check-ins
"Information is the oxygen of the modern age. It seeps through the walls topped
by barbed wire, it wafts across the electrified borders." - Ronald Reagan
"The more corrupt the state, the more it legislates." - Tacitus
"Molann an obair an fear" - Irish Saying
(The work praises the man.)
"No matter how big and powerful government gets, and the many services it
provides, it can never take the place of volunteers." - Ronald Reagan
"We are fast approaching the stage of ultimate inversion: the stage where
the government is free to do anything it pleases, while the citizens may
act only by permission." - Ayn Rand
1:30 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
I realize the system sends each coordinator an
automatic email when requests
are made for their assigned area.. But as I have done over the years.. I
have changed ISP's or Careers and forgot to update my email with certain
systems..
Shouldn't the coordinators all have an ampr.org Email address? That
would allow easily handling multiple coordinator contacts as well as
changing coordinators or email addresses.
"The solution to many software issues is another layer of indirection."
Bill, WA7NWP
1:36 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
This means that all coordinators should have an AMPR e-mail system running,
or at least access to an AMPR e-mail system.
And this means an additional account to check (or more often NOT to check).
Not to mention system availability on an AMPR mail system at someone's home
(no pun intended).
Really, I would prefer to get notifications on my main mail account which I
check daily multiple times..
Marius, YO2LOJ
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Vodall
Sent: Tuesday, January 12, 2016 20:30
To: AMPRNet working group
Subject: Re: [44net] Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Shouldn't the coordinators all have an ampr.org Email address? That
would allow easily handling multiple coordinator contacts as well as
changing coordinators or email addresses.
1:38 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
+1
Best regards.
--
Tom - SP2L
------------------------------------
It is nice to be important.
But it is more important to be nice!
3:03 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Marius / Bill / et al;
This means that all coordinators should have an AMPR
e-mail system running,
or at least access to an AMPR e-mail system.
Nothing a .forward file couldn't also fix for you :)
Shouldn't the coordinators all have an ampr.org
Email address? That
would allow easily handling multiple coordinator contacts as well as
changing coordinators or email addresses.
This thread really has become so far off the original track you'd think
it's another government run railroad. While I think I'm one of, if not
the only coordinator that uses an *.ampr.org email (and has for about 2
decades now) let me try to get the thread back on it's original track.
The thread if you dig back enough I believe goes towards making ip
allocation requests more automated, not all of a sudden after 2+ decades
of allocating IP space to attack the position of or the logistics of the
coordinators (or do we prefer to just shoot each other in the foot?) So
how do we accomplish this? Before I get into that, let me clarify
something we're overlooking here;
Coordinators are scoped out and picked by Brian Kantor. No coordinator
or coordinator want-to-be can simply enter themselves into the portal
and get coordinator privileges. If BK is fine with who he selects as
coordinators than we should (as guests on his network) be satisfied with
his decision and not question that in what he wishes to do. If you run
down the list of those who are coordinators, many of them have been
doing so for well over 10 if not over 20 years. I fail to see where all
of a sudden this is an issue? Are we that bored where we as 'inventors'
have run out of things to invent so we begin to unconsciously attack
others? I'd be more concerned from a security point of view about
non-amateurs getting into our network from non-44net means than what
occurs within our own network... and yes this has occurred! Rather than
subliminally insult the intelligence of BK by hinting that his selection
of coordinators is not one to be appreciated also shows by action that
the use he gives us all a corner of his 44/8 network is unappreciated.
</rant>
<$0.02>
Now.. as to the automation of requesting subnets, we would need a very
detailed system to accomplish this. One that just adds subnets by means
of a request could hurt others, even if the requester uses a cert-based
identifier schema. I've had a bunch request /16 subnets for the purposes
of running commercial SIP trunk hosting, commercial video streaming,
etc. An automated system that would do this at will would harm others.
We'd also need to come up with a way to auto-determine when someone
decides to leave 44-net so their block could go back into the pool and
DNS taken out so incoming frames to UCSD can be halted from entering the
encap system. All too often are people overly anxious to get on the
amprnet, but when they decide it's either not for them or they find
something else to occupy their time 99% of the time they fail to inform
their coordinator that they've decided to leave.
As I stated yesterday, while I'm not against the idea, it'd have to be
very carefully thought out and properly engineered before implemented. I
can envision more bumps in this road than smoothness. When a human
element exists, its extremely difficult for a robot to "guess".
</$0.02>
--
The only thing worse than an extreme left-wing state is an extreme
left-wing commonwealth protected by the sovereign doctrine.
73 de Brian - N1URO
email: (see above)
Web: http://www.n1uro.net/
Ampr1: http://n1uro.ampr.org/
Ampr2: http://nos.n1uro.ampr.org
Linux Amateur Radio Services
axMail-Fax & URONode
http://uronode.sourceforge.net
http://axmail.sourceforge.net
AmprNet coordinator for:
Connecticut, Delaware, Maine,
Maryland, Massachusetts,
New Hampshire, Pennsylvania,
Rhode Island, and Vermont.
4:22 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Amen.
Also, a human in the loop can look at things like allocation based on
potential growth, keeping a sanity check on the size of the subnet, etc.
I've negotiated with requesters to make sure we were doing the right thing
by them and the larger community.
I have one group that has grown in address space need and appear to have
much more growth coming. They have managed what they have well, so I helped
facilitate a request for a /16 through ARDC and we thought ahead in case at
some point we may want to advertize a /15 on BGP.
On Tue, Jan 12, 2016 at 12:03 PM, Brian <n1uro(a)n1uro.ampr.org> wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
Marius / Bill / et al;
--
------------------------------
John D. Hays
K7VE
PO Box 1223, Edmonds, WA 98020-1223
<http://k7ve.org/blog> <http://twitter.com/#!/john_hays>
<http://www.facebook.com/john.d.hays>
This means that all coordinators should have an
AMPR e-mail system
running,
or at least access to an AMPR e-mail system.
Nothing a .forward file couldn't also fix for you :)
Shouldn't the coordinators all have an
ampr.org Email address? That
would allow easily handling multiple coordinator contacts as well as
changing coordinators or email addresses.
This thread really has become so far off the original track you'd think
it's another government run railroad. While I think I'm one of, if not
the only coordinator that uses an *.ampr.org email (and has for about 2
decades now) let me try to get the thread back on it's original track.
The thread if you dig back enough I believe goes towards making ip
allocation requests more automated, not all of a sudden after 2+ decades
of allocating IP space to attack the position of or the logistics of the
coordinators (or do we prefer to just shoot each other in the foot?) So
how do we accomplish this? Before I get into that, let me clarify
something we're overlooking here;
Coordinators are scoped out and picked by Brian Kantor. No coordinator
or coordinator want-to-be can simply enter themselves into the portal
and get coordinator privileges. If BK is fine with who he selects as
coordinators than we should (as guests on his network) be satisfied with
his decision and not question that in what he wishes to do. If you run
down the list of those who are coordinators, many of them have been
doing so for well over 10 if not over 20 years. I fail to see where all
of a sudden this is an issue? Are we that bored where we as 'inventors'
have run out of things to invent so we begin to unconsciously attack
others? I'd be more concerned from a security point of view about
non-amateurs getting into our network from non-44net means than what
occurs within our own network... and yes this has occurred! Rather than
subliminally insult the intelligence of BK by hinting that his selection
of coordinators is not one to be appreciated also shows by action that
the use he gives us all a corner of his 44/8 network is unappreciated.
</rant>
<$0.02>
Now.. as to the automation of requesting subnets, we would need a very
detailed system to accomplish this. One that just adds subnets by means
of a request could hurt others, even if the requester uses a cert-based
identifier schema. I've had a bunch request /16 subnets for the purposes
of running commercial SIP trunk hosting, commercial video streaming,
etc. An automated system that would do this at will would harm others.
We'd also need to come up with a way to auto-determine when someone
decides to leave 44-net so their block could go back into the pool and
DNS taken out so incoming frames to UCSD can be halted from entering the
encap system. All too often are people overly anxious to get on the
amprnet, but when they decide it's either not for them or they find
something else to occupy their time 99% of the time they fail to inform
their coordinator that they've decided to leave.
As I stated yesterday, while I'm not against the idea, it'd have to be
very carefully thought out and properly engineered before implemented. I
can envision more bumps in this road than smoothness. When a human
element exists, its extremely difficult for a robot to "guess".
</$0.02>
--
The only thing worse than an extreme left-wing state is an extreme
left-wing commonwealth protected by the sovereign doctrine.
73 de Brian - N1URO
email: (see above)
Web: http://www.n1uro.net/
Ampr1: http://n1uro.ampr.org/
Ampr2: http://nos.n1uro.ampr.org
Linux Amateur Radio Services
axMail-Fax & URONode
http://uronode.sourceforge.net
http://axmail.sourceforge.net
AmprNet coordinator for:
Connecticut, Delaware, Maine,
Maryland, Massachusetts,
New Hampshire, Pennsylvania,
Rhode Island, and Vermont.
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
13 Jan
13 Jan
12:55 a.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
There seems to be some confusion here. The discussion
was never about
verifying the identities of coordinators.
The original suggestion was that there was a way to bypass simple
address assignment by automating the process.
I explained at the time that the coordinators perform a valuable service
that can't be automated in any practical way.
Brian,
I understand that the suggestion was to automate the IP assignment
process, and I was under the impression that it didn't work out
because it's so hard to identify applicants in an automated system.
I think that the coordinators could serve in a "pilot" project which
can be used to work out the kinks in a process available to any ham
who seeks to use it. I'm sorry that I didn't explain that clearly.
I'm late to the party, so I'll ask that we talk about the existing
process in general terms: that will give me and the other readers a
notion of what's possible. To that end, please answer these questions:
1. What changes, if any, would you like to make?
2. Do the coordinators use shell access to modify DNS zone files at
ampr.org?
3. Is there a web or other interface available to them that helps them
works with the DNS? If so, what is it?
Thanks for your patience, and let me add my thanks for your years of
service.
73,
Bill, KW4OC
1:04 a.m.
New subject: Mail gateway from HF BBS to Internet ?
Hi there
is there any system that allow to send mail from internet (say in our case from
User(a)ampr.org) to any BBS (again in our case user@bbs-callsign) ?
15 years ago we did it and we could send mail from internet to any BBS vice versa
we had a Engine on the bbs that pick up any Email address and send it to the Internet
gateway and same was on the internet that mail from internet to user@bbs was forward to
the bbs
so is there any system that do it today ?
Thanks for any info
Ronen - 4Z4ZQ
http://www.ronen.org
2:14 a.m.
New subject: Mail gateway from HF BBS to Internet ?
Hello Ronan,
Mine does in a specific string. Contact me off list for info.
On January 13, 2016 1:04:23 AM R P <ronenp(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
Hi there
is there any system that allow to send mail from internet (say in our case
from User(a)ampr.org) to any BBS (again in our case user@bbs-callsign) ?
15 years ago we did it and we could send mail from internet to any BBS
vice versa
we had a Engine on the bbs that pick up any Email address and send it to
the Internet gateway and same was on the internet that mail from internet
to user@bbs was forward to the bbs
so is there any system that do it today ?
Thanks for any info
Ronen - 4Z4ZQ
http://www.ronen.org
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
14 Jan
14 Jan
8:47 a.m.
New subject: Mail gateway from HF BBS to Internet ?
Please do not "hijack" email threads, it really destroys the inboxes of
those OMs ordering these mailing list discussion by thread.
Please compose a new email message to 44net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu when you
start a new topic. Use the reply button to reply to a topic.
Thank you very much for your assistance.
Vy 73 de Marc, LX1DUC
On 2016-01-13 07:04, R P wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
Hi there
is there any system that allow to send mail from internet (say in our
case from User(a)ampr.org) to any BBS (again in our case
user@bbs-callsign) ?
15 years ago we did it and we could send mail from internet to any
BBS vice versa
we had a Engine on the bbs that pick up any Email address and send
it to the Internet gateway and same was on the internet that mail
from internet to user@bbs was forward to the bbs
so is there any system that do it today ?
Thanks for any info
Ronen - 4Z4ZQ
http://www.ronen.org
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
15 Jan
15 Jan
12:43 p.m.
New subject: Mail gateway from HF BBS to Internet ?
Hi,
Happy New Year to all.
Regarding HF mail on AMPRnet, I would like to add that it would be a
nice idea if we could have PACTOR or RPR support in AMPRnet.
Perhaps URONODE could support PACTOR 2/3/4 MODEMS because at the
moment the only radio e-mail system that works is WINLINK and
unfortunately there is nothing like this on AMPRnet!
At the moment the only mode that could work on AMPRnet is PACKET RADIO
with a TNC or Soundcard but these leave a lot to be desired on HF
since 300 baud PACKET RADIO on HF for mail is an extremely
sloooooooooooooooooow mode!
Please correct me if I'm wrong!
---
73 Δημήτρης - SV1UY
73 de Demetre - SV1UY
IP Coordinator for AMPRNet in Greece
e-mail: demetre.sv1uy(a)gmail.com
Radio e-mail: sv1uy(a)winlink.org
AMPRnet e-mail: sv1uy(a)sv1uy.ampr.org
PACKET mail: SV1UY(a)SV1UY.ATH.GRC.EU
WEB: http://www.qsl.net/sv1uy
On 13 January 2016 at 06:04, R P <ronenp(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
Hi there
is there any system that allow to send mail from internet (say in our case from
User(a)ampr.org) to any BBS (again in our case user@bbs-callsign) ?
15 years ago we did it and we could send mail from internet to any BBS vice versa
we had a Engine on the bbs that pick up any Email address and send it to the Internet
gateway and same was on the internet that mail from internet to user@bbs was forward to
the bbs
so is there any system that do it today ?
Thanks for any info
Ronen - 4Z4ZQ
http://www.ronen.org
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
1:02 p.m.
New subject: Mail gateway from HF BBS to Internet ?
BPQ32 Mail/LinBPQ besides being a conventional packet BBS supports several
HF modes including Pactor, RPR, WINMOR and ARDOP, and can forward to Winlink
and ampr.org mail servers. The networking component also supports IPIP
tunnels and RIP44d.
And for those who don't think Microsoft is a dirty word, it runs on Windows
as well as Linux.
73,
John G8BPQ
-----Original Message-----
From: 44Net [mailto:44net-bounces+john.wiseman=cantab.net@hamradio.ucsd.edu]
On Behalf Of Demetre - SV1UY
Sent: 15 January 2016 17:43
To: AMPRNet working group
Subject: Re: [44net] Mail gateway from HF BBS to Internet ?
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
Hi,
Happy New Year to all.
Regarding HF mail on AMPRnet, I would like to add that it would be a
nice idea if we could have PACTOR or RPR support in AMPRnet.
Perhaps URONODE could support PACTOR 2/3/4 MODEMS because at the
moment the only radio e-mail system that works is WINLINK and
unfortunately there is nothing like this on AMPRnet!
At the moment the only mode that could work on AMPRnet is PACKET RADIO
with a TNC or Soundcard but these leave a lot to be desired on HF
since 300 baud PACKET RADIO on HF for mail is an extremely
sloooooooooooooooooow mode!
Please correct me if I'm wrong!
---
73 Δημήτρης - SV1UY
73 de Demetre - SV1UY
IP Coordinator for AMPRNet in Greece
e-mail: demetre.sv1uy(a)gmail.com
Radio e-mail: sv1uy(a)winlink.org
AMPRnet e-mail: sv1uy(a)sv1uy.ampr.org
PACKET mail: SV1UY(a)SV1UY.ATH.GRC.EU
WEB: http://www.qsl.net/sv1uy
On 13 January 2016 at 06:04, R P <ronenp(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
Hi there
is there any system that allow to send mail from internet (say in our case
from
User(a)ampr.org) to any BBS (again in our case user@bbs-callsign)
?
15 years ago we did it and we could send mail from
internet to any BBS
vice versa
we had a Engine on the bbs that pick up any Email
address and send it to
the Internet gateway and same was on the internet that mail
from internet
to user@bbs was forward to the bbs
so is there any system that do it today ?
Thanks for any info
Ronen - 4Z4ZQ
http://www.ronen.org
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
1:17 p.m.
New subject: Mail gateway from HF BBS to Internet ?
He he he,
OK John, I might get converted to BPQ after I return back home to
Athens as I am in the NORTH EAST of ENGLAND at the moment until 17
February 2016.
I will contact you as soon I get back to Athens for help in setting up
a LINUX AMPRnet GATEWAY using BPQ because PACTOR and RPR support is
very important to me! As for WINDOZE, I have no problem and I do not
consider it a swear word! I just call it WINDOZE though! hi hi hi!!! I
use both systems on a daily basis!
73 de Demetre M/SV1UY (loc. IO94ew for now)
---
73 Δημήτρης - SV1UY
73 de Demetre - SV1UY
IP Coordinator for AMPRNet in Greece
e-mail: demetre.sv1uy(a)gmail.com
Radio e-mail: sv1uy(a)winlink.org
AMPRnet e-mail: sv1uy(a)sv1uy.ampr.org
PACKET mail: SV1UY(a)SV1UY.ATH.GRC.EU
WEB: http://www.qsl.net/sv1uy
On 15 January 2016 at 18:02, John Wiseman <john.wiseman(a)cantab.net> wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
BPQ32 Mail/LinBPQ besides being a conventional packet BBS supports several
HF modes including Pactor, RPR, WINMOR and ARDOP, and can forward to Winlink
and ampr.org mail servers. The networking component also supports IPIP
tunnels and RIP44d.
And for those who don't think Microsoft is a dirty word, it runs on Windows
as well as Linux.
73,
John G8BPQ
-----Original Message-----
From: 44Net [mailto:44net-bounces+john.wiseman=cantab.net@hamradio.ucsd.edu]
On Behalf Of Demetre - SV1UY
Sent: 15 January 2016 17:43
To: AMPRNet working group
Subject: Re: [44net] Mail gateway from HF BBS to Internet ?
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
Hi,
Happy New Year to all.
Regarding HF mail on AMPRnet, I would like to add that it would be a
nice idea if we could have PACTOR or RPR support in AMPRnet.
Perhaps URONODE could support PACTOR 2/3/4 MODEMS because at the
moment the only radio e-mail system that works is WINLINK and
unfortunately there is nothing like this on AMPRnet!
At the moment the only mode that could work on AMPRnet is PACKET RADIO
with a TNC or Soundcard but these leave a lot to be desired on HF
since 300 baud PACKET RADIO on HF for mail is an extremely
sloooooooooooooooooow mode!
Please correct me if I'm wrong!
---
73 Δημήτρης - SV1UY
73 de Demetre - SV1UY
IP Coordinator for AMPRNet in Greece
e-mail: demetre.sv1uy(a)gmail.com
Radio e-mail: sv1uy(a)winlink.org
AMPRnet e-mail: sv1uy(a)sv1uy.ampr.org
PACKET mail: SV1UY(a)SV1UY.ATH.GRC.EU
WEB: http://www.qsl.net/sv1uy
On 13 January 2016 at 06:04, R P <ronenp(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
Hi there
is there any system that allow to send mail from internet (say in our case
from
User(a)ampr.org) to any BBS (again in our case user@bbs-callsign)
?
15 years ago we did it and we could send mail
from internet to any BBS
vice versa
we had a Engine on the bbs that pick up any
Email address and send it to
the Internet gateway and same was on the internet
that mail from internet
to user@bbs was forward to the bbs
so is there any system that do it today ?
Thanks for any info
Ronen - 4Z4ZQ
http://www.ronen.org
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
13 Jan
13 Jan
9:25 a.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
On Tue, Jan 12, 2016 at 11:55:19PM -0600, Bill Horne wrote:
I understand that the suggestion was to automate the
IP assignment
process, and I was under the impression that it didn't work out
because it's so hard to identify applicants in an automated system.
It wasn't a suggestion, it was an ill-tempered gripe. It stems from a
comment on one person's difficulty in contacting the Israeli coordinator;
we're investigating now but it seems possible that the reason he's not
replying is because he's dead. Given the average age of most hams,
that's always a possibility, even in this group.
Nearly every suggestion to automate assignment has run up against at least
the following problem: that we have to have some way of knowing that the
requesting party is a bona-fide ham radio operator who knows the right
thing to ask for and is going to use the allocation only for ham purposes.
No, it's impractical to replace the coordinators with an automated system
because of all the other things they do, among which are to verify the
validity of the person requesting, to check on the size of the subnet
requested (ie, see if he's asking for what he really needs), assist the
requestor with getting his system set up, and so on. Even if we were
to adopt LOTW or some other identity verification process, these other
tasks can't be automated. These volunteers are valuable!
I'm late to the party, so I'll ask that we
talk about the existing
process in general terms: that will give me and the other readers a
notion of what's possible. To that end, please answer these questions:
1. What changes, if any, would you like to make?
Me? I wasn't suggesting any changes. The existing portal works fairly
well for a first cut at making one. Undoubtedly we'll refine it but that
depends on volunteers to do the design and programming (PHP, Javascript),
and so far several calls for volunteers have fallen on deaf ears.
It seems that a lot of hams aren't willing to volunteer their time (nor
money) to support AMPRNet, they just want to use it. A lot of users won't
even bother to subscribe to this mailing list. I could forcibly subscribe
them when they join the portal but it goes against my principles to do so.
2. Do the coordinators use shell access to modify DNS
zone files at
ampr.org?
No.
3. Is there a web or other interface available to them
that helps them
works with the DNS? If so, what is it?
There is an email robot. The portal has a DNS provision that's not
operational, primarily because of the logistics of getting the existing
DNS system and data converted over. It's turning out to be a Herculean
task, primarily because of all the cleanup of the data that has to
be done first. The existing DNS has thirty years of cruft in it and
every volunteer (there have been two) has bounced off the sheer size
of the task. There's a LOT of crud in it. I work on it when I can.
(It's been suggested that we simply start fresh with an empty DNS.
Or throw away all the entries that are more than five years old.
Though doable, neither seems very practical because of the highly
negative effect they'd have on existing users, some of whom have
legitimately been in the DNS for twenty years.) I think that if
there were easy solutions we would already have implemented them.
- Brian
11:56 a.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
On Wed, Jan 13, 2016 at 6:25 AM, Brian Kantor <Brian(a)ucsd.edu> wrote:
(It's been suggested that we simply start fresh
with an empty DNS.
Or throw away all the entries that are more than five years old.
Though doable, neither seems very practical because of the highly
negative effect they'd have on existing users, some of whom have
legitimately been in the DNS for twenty years.) I think that if
there were easy solutions we would already have implemented them.
I just thought of another possibility. We could ask that the regional
coordinators do an audit of their IP spaces in conjunction with the
above suggestions as they're likely to have closer relationships with
the end user or be more familiar with the record keeping of their
countries amateur radio licensing. Then we can check off that IP
space as "claimed" or "reclaim" it back into the pool.
<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail>
This
email has been sent from a virus-free computer protected by Avast.
www.avast.com
<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail>
<#DDB4FAA8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
12:06 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Don;
On Wed, 2016-01-13 at 08:56 -0800, Don Fanning wrote:
I just thought of another possibility. We could ask
that the regional
coordinators do an audit of their IP spaces in conjunction with the
above suggestions as they're likely to have closer relationships with
the end user or be more familiar with the record keeping of their
countries amateur radio licensing. Then we can check off that IP
space as "claimed" or "reclaim" it back into the pool.
Some are running a DNS entry for a mail service but aren't hosting any
blocks. This wouldn't work in this scenario.
--
The only thing worse than an extreme left-wing state is an extreme
left-wing commonwealth protected by the sovereign doctrine.
73 de Brian - N1URO
email: (see above)
Web: http://www.n1uro.net/
Ampr1: http://n1uro.ampr.org/
Ampr2: http://nos.n1uro.ampr.org
Linux Amateur Radio Services
axMail-Fax & URONode
http://uronode.sourceforge.net
http://axmail.sourceforge.net
AmprNet coordinator for:
Connecticut, Delaware, Maine,
Maryland, Massachusetts,
New Hampshire, Pennsylvania,
Rhode Island, and Vermont.
12:42 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
what is the problem (if any at all) that the AMPR.ORG DNS have with so much Records
in it ?
if there is no problem why bothering to clean it up ...
Ronen - 4Z4ZQ
http://www.ronen.org
________________________________________
1:27 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
If there is a problem with coordinators "dropping out" for various
reasons (forgot to update contact into, deceased, etc), then there is a
possible way to automate this:
-Say every 3-6 months (maybe more, maybe less), have the ampr.org system
send out a message to the registered coordinators address asking to
verify/update their contact info. You could also make this a
semi-annual affairs in like January and July (or any other two months).
Failure to do so after 3 tries over a week or so results in a message
being sent to a predefined address (even this list) saying that the
automated verification system failed to receive a response from x. You
could even go one step further and have several coordinators for the
verification system itself which receive notification of the first
several failed attempts at contacting a coordinator, so they can take
steps to get in touch and keep the final messages from going out to the
list. The possibilities are endless, and it likely would not be too
difficult for someone with a moderate amount of <insert favorite
scripting language for web apps here> using a database backed system to
implement it (or add fields to the existing ampr.org databases for
verification).
This would help ensure that any "gaps" are fixed within a reasonable
amount of time for this volunteer run project.
Just my 2 cents.
73
Stacy
KG7QIN
On 01/13/2016 09:42 AM, R P wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
what is the problem (if any at all) that the AMPR.ORG DNS have with so much Records
in it ?
if there is no problem why bothering to clean it up ...
Ronen - 4Z4ZQ
http://www.ronen.org
________________________________________
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
1:46 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Hi Stacy, good idea.
We verify people's email addresses as valid on an annual basis. It's
probably not very hard for Chris (G1FEF, the author of the portal
software) to alter that schedule for people who have the 'coordinator'
flag turned on in their user record. Exactly who and how the
notifications take place needs to be worked out but I don't think it
presents a lot of difficulty. Let's see what Chris says.
- Brian
On Wed, Jan 13, 2016 at 10:27:21AM -0800, Stacy wrote:
If there is a problem with coordinators "dropping
out" for various
reasons (forgot to update contact into, deceased, etc), then there is
a possible way to automate this:
-Say every 3-6 months (maybe more, maybe less), have the ampr.org
system send out a message to the registered coordinators address
asking to verify/update their contact info. You could also make this
a semi-annual affairs in like January and July (or any other two
months). Failure to do so after 3 tries over a week or so results in
a message being sent to a predefined address (even this list) saying
that the automated verification system failed to receive a response
from x. You could even go one step further and have several
coordinators for the verification system itself which receive
notification of the first several failed attempts at contacting a
coordinator, so they can take steps to get in touch and keep the
final messages from going out to the list. The possibilities are
endless, and it likely would not be too difficult for someone with a
moderate amount of <insert favorite scripting language for web apps
here> using a database backed system to implement it (or add fields
to the existing ampr.org databases for verification).
This would help ensure that any "gaps" are fixed within a reasonable
amount of time for this volunteer run project.
Just my 2 cents.
73
Stacy
KG7QIN
2:04 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Hi
As a coordinator I would have no problem revalidating on a regular basis.
Very good idea and so simple!
Regards
Andy Brittain
G0HXT
g0hxt(a)greatbrittain.co.uk
On 13 Jan 2016, at 18:46, Brian Kantor
<Brian(a)UCSD.Edu> wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
Hi Stacy, good idea.
We verify people's email addresses as valid on an annual basis. It's
probably not very hard for Chris (G1FEF, the author of the portal
software) to alter that schedule for people who have the 'coordinator'
flag turned on in their user record. Exactly who and how the
notifications take place needs to be worked out but I don't think it
presents a lot of difficulty. Let's see what Chris says.
- Brian
On Wed, Jan 13, 2016 at 10:27:21AM -0800, Stacy wrote:
If there is a problem with coordinators
"dropping out" for various
reasons (forgot to update contact into, deceased, etc), then there is
a possible way to automate this:
-Say every 3-6 months (maybe more, maybe less), have the ampr.org
system send out a message to the registered coordinators address
asking to verify/update their contact info. You could also make this
a semi-annual affairs in like January and July (or any other two
months). Failure to do so after 3 tries over a week or so results in
a message being sent to a predefined address (even this list) saying
that the automated verification system failed to receive a response
from x. You could even go one step further and have several
coordinators for the verification system itself which receive
notification of the first several failed attempts at contacting a
coordinator, so they can take steps to get in touch and keep the
final messages from going out to the list. The possibilities are
endless, and it likely would not be too difficult for someone with a
moderate amount of <insert favorite scripting language for web apps
here> using a database backed system to implement it (or add fields
to the existing ampr.org databases for verification).
This would help ensure that any "gaps" are fixed within a reasonable
amount of time for this volunteer run project.
Just my 2 cents.
73
Stacy
KG7QIN
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net 
7:30 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Sounds like parania is setting in here.
Whats wrong with rhe system Brian started.
This is a hobby... Your trying to make is so complex, why dont you go further and ask for
bloid tests maybe make use of a work dongle to co-auth a log in, maybe even a yubiko key.
Why not get even further paranoid by using a vlan and...
Sounds way over the top to me for a hobby... It is not that we are protecting the crown
jewels
My 5c worth
If it works dont touch it as it will destroy it
Sent from my Samsung 6 Edge!
-----Original Message-----
From: Stacy <kg7qin(a)arrl.net>
To: AMPRNet working group <44net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu>
Sent: Thu, 14 Jan 2016 4:27
Subject: Re: [44net] Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
If there is a problem with coordinators "dropping out" for various
reasons (forgot to update contact into, deceased, etc), then there is a
possible way to automate this:
-Say every 3-6 months (maybe more, maybe less), have the ampr.org system
send out a message to the registered coordinators address asking to
verify/update their contact info. You could also make this a
semi-annual affairs in like January and July (or any other two months).
Failure to do so after 3 tries over a week or so results in a message
being sent to a predefined address (even this list) saying that the
automated verification system failed to receive a response from x. You
could even go one step further and have several coordinators for the
verification system itself which receive notification of the first
several failed attempts at contacting a coordinator, so they can take
steps to get in touch and keep the final messages from going out to the
list. The possibilities are endless, and it likely would not be too
difficult for someone with a moderate amount of <insert favorite
scripting language for web apps here> using a database backed system to
implement it (or add fields to the existing ampr.org databases for
verification).
This would help ensure that any "gaps" are fixed within a reasonable
amount of time for this volunteer run project.
Just my 2 cents.
73
Stacy
KG7QIN
On 01/13/2016 09:42 AM, R P wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
what is the problem (if any at all) that the AMPR.ORG DNS have with so much Records
in it ?
if there is no problem why bothering to clean it up ...
Ronen - 4Z4ZQ
http://www.ronen.org
________________________________________
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
7:50 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
I was one of the very early, if not original, regional coordinators (Utah
back then, Western Washington now, with a gap in between).
I don't have a problem of periodically letting someone know I'm alive --
but with the advent of portal.ampr.org it would be pretty simple to run a
query that says, 'are there requests that haven't been serviced in (time
period)' and when was the last time I logged in. If I haven't logged in
and there are waiting requests -- ping me with an email (unlikely in my
case, if I'm alive and not on a no Internet situation -- I'm online pretty
much 14 hours a day between job and personal). Allow a reasonable amount
of time for me to respond, by simply logging in.
As Brian said, this whole thread started because ONE person didn't get a
response from the designated coordinator for his area.
I like the idea of putting the portal into an open source development
environment, like GitHub. There does need to be a core team that makes
sure that features aren't stepping on each other.
The last couple of times I tried to use the dns-robot, it failed. I would
like to see the portal handle the DNS, without the need to import the old
hosts file. If people are active, they can login to the portal and setup
their DNS records. The portal could expire DNS and address entries if
someone didn't login in a predetermined time (a year or more).
Delegated DNS is also a good solution, for example HamWan.Org -- and the
overall network should handle DNS records that are not in the central
ampr.org DNS server.
On Wed, Jan 13, 2016 at 4:30 PM, VK4AA Sam <vk4aa(a)vk4aa.com.au> wrote:
> (Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
> _______________________________________________
> Sounds like parania is setting in here.
> Whats wrong with rhe system Brian started.
> This is a hobby... Your trying to make is so complex, why dont you go
> further and ask for bloid tests maybe make use of a work dongle to co-auth
> a log in, maybe even a yubiko key. Why not get even further paranoid by
> using a vlan and...
>
> Sounds way over the top to me for a hobby... It is not that we are
> protecting the crown jewels
>
> My 5c worth
> If it works dont touch it as it will destroy it
>
> Sent from my Samsung 6 Edge!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stacy <kg7qin(a)arrl.net>
> To: AMPRNet working group <44net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu>
> Sent: Thu, 14 Jan 2016 4:27
> Subject: Re: [44net] Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
>
> (Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
> _______________________________________________
> If there is a problem with coordinators "dropping out" for various
> reasons (forgot to update contact into, deceased, etc), then there is a
> possible way to automate this:
>
> -Say every 3-6 months (maybe more, maybe less), have the ampr.org system
> send out a message to the registered coordinators address asking to
> verify/update their contact info. You could also make this a
> semi-annual affairs in like January and July (or any other two months).
> Failure to do so after 3 tries over a week or so results in a message
> being sent to a predefined address (even this list) saying that the
> automated verification system failed to receive a response from x. You
> could even go one step further and have several coordinators for the
> verification system itself which receive notification of the first
> several failed attempts at contacting a coordinator, so they can take
> steps to get in touch and keep the final messages from going out to the
> list. The possibilities are endless, and it likely would not be too
> difficult for someone with a moderate amount of <insert favorite
> scripting language for web apps here> using a database backed system to
> implement it (or add fields to the existing ampr.org databases for
> verification).
>
> This would help ensure that any "gaps" are fixed within a reasonable
> amount of time for this volunteer run project.
>
> Just my 2 cents.
>
> 73
> Stacy
> KG7QIN
>
> On 01/13/2016 09:42 AM, R P wrote:
> > (Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
> > _______________________________________________
> > what is the problem (if any at all) that the AMPR.ORG DNS have with
> so much Records in it ?
> > if there is no problem why bothering to clean it up ...
> > Ronen - 4Z4ZQ
> > http://www.ronen.org
> >
> > ________________________________________
> >
> > _________________________________________
> > 44Net mailing list
> > 44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
> > http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
>
> _________________________________________
> 44Net mailing list
> 44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
> http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
>
8:14 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Idaho maybe? :)
On Wed, January 13, 2016 7:50 pm, K7VE - John wrote:
(Utah back then, Western Washington now, with a gap in
between).
--
Charles J. Hargrove - N2NOV
NYC ARECS/RACES Citywide Radio Officer/Skywarn Coord.
NYC-ARECS/RACES Net Mon. @ 8:30PM 147.360/107.2 PL
http://www.nyc-arecs.org and http://www.nyc-skywarn.org
NY-NBEMS Net Saturdays @ 10AM & USeast-NBEMS Net Wednesdays @ 7PM
on 7.036 Mhz USB/1500 hz waterfall spot; Olivia 8/500 check-ins
"Information is the oxygen of the modern age. It seeps through the walls topped
by barbed wire, it wafts across the electrified borders." - Ronald Reagan
"The more corrupt the state, the more it legislates." - Tacitus
"Molann an obair an fear" - Irish Saying
(The work praises the man.)
"No matter how big and powerful government gets, and the many services it
provides, it can never take the place of volunteers." - Ronald Reagan
"We are fast approaching the stage of ultimate inversion: the stage where
the government is free to do anything it pleases, while the citizens may
act only by permission." - Ayn Rand
9:02 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Sam;
On Thu, 2016-01-14 at 10:30 +1000, VK4AA Sam wrote:
Sounds way over the top to me for a hobby... It is
not that we are
protecting the crown jewels
My 5c worth
If it works dont touch it as it will destroy it
I'm in agreement with you. This isn't something you can do just because
you pass a test and get a ham license, this is something we've been
blessed with out of the kindness of a single individual who was
intelligent enough to reserve a /8 IPv4 subnet and share it with the
rest of the world for amateur usage.
How BK wants his network to run is entirely up to him (and ARDC).
We should respect his wishes and keep in the back of our minds that at
any time he could sell the /8 off to a commercial entity - which would
be like cashing in a current jackpot powerball ticket, and these more
recent conversations would all be mooted by default.
--
Sometimes we need to look in the mirror to find the answer to what's
wrong with the current generation...
73 de Brian - N1URO
email: (see above)
Web: http://www.n1uro.net/
Ampr1: http://n1uro.ampr.org/
Ampr2: http://nos.n1uro.ampr.org
Linux Amateur Radio Services
axMail-Fax & URONode
http://uronode.sourceforge.net
http://axmail.sourceforge.net
AmprNet coordinator for:
Connecticut, Delaware, Maine,
Maryland, Massachusetts,
New Hampshire, Pennsylvania,
Rhode Island, and Vermont.
10:48 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Sorry, it's not Brian Kantor's network (even though I kindly acknowledge
all of the work that he's put in!).
It's the amateur radio community's network.
My take is different:
What is the current process?
Who believes that they're not being properly served by that process?
What percentage of requests does that amount to? What are the issues?
How much work would it take to improve the current process by X%?
If the number of issues vs. the number of requests is less than about
10% - the current system is operating better than the majority of
systems (of any kind) out there!
If the number of issues is significantly above 10%, and the amount of
work that it would take is small - it's worth looking at on its own merits.
If none of the above is evident, it only makes sense to change if there
are people willing to dedicate the effort to the change and support the
result. This is a hobby about technology and change, so it's OK to
propose change even if the result isn't huge. We'd still be on AM on HF
if we didn't grow thanks to technological change.
That doesn't make it imperative, however, and maybe an alternative is to
apply change to a subset of the allocations - a new, automated system
doesn't have to take over all of the 44 net, it could be set up for
selected subsets to test and innovate on.
- Richard, VE7CVS
On 1/13/16 6:02 PM, Brian wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
Sam;
On Thu, 2016-01-14 at 10:30 +1000, VK4AA Sam wrote:
Sounds way over the top to me for a hobby... It
is not that we are
protecting the crown jewels
My 5c worth
If it works dont touch it as it will destroy it
I'm in agreement with you.
This isn't something you can do just because
you pass a test and get a ham license, this is something we've been
blessed with out of the kindness of a single individual who was
intelligent enough to reserve a /8 IPv4 subnet and share it with the
rest of the world for amateur usage.
How BK wants his network to run is entirely up to him (and ARDC).
We should respect his wishes and keep in the back of our minds that at
any time he could sell the /8 off to a commercial entity - which would
be like cashing in a current jackpot powerball ticket, and these more
recent conversations would all be mooted by default.
14 Jan
14 Jan
5:06 a.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Agreed here.. and I am surely, No Body!!
:)
Have a great day.
If it ain't broke don't fix it.
73 all jerry n9lya
Indiana IP Coordinator.
-----Original Message-----
From: 44Net
[mailto:44net-bounces+n9lya=uronode.n9lya.ampr.org@hamradio.ucsd.edu] On
Behalf Of Brian
Sent: Wednesday, January 13, 2016 9:03 PM
To: AMPRNet working group <44net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu>
Subject: Re: [44net] Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
Sam;
On Thu, 2016-01-14 at 10:30 +1000, VK4AA Sam wrote:
Sounds way over the top to me for a hobby... It is
not that we are
protecting the crown jewels
My 5c worth
If it works dont touch it as it will destroy it
I'm in agreement with you. This isn't something you can do just because you
pass a test and get a ham license, this is something we've been blessed with
out of the kindness of a single individual who was intelligent enough to
reserve a /8 IPv4 subnet and share it with the rest of the world for amateur
usage.
How BK wants his network to run is entirely up to him (and ARDC).
We should respect his wishes and keep in the back of our minds that at any
time he could sell the /8 off to a commercial entity - which would be like
cashing in a current jackpot powerball ticket, and these more recent
conversations would all be mooted by default.
--
Sometimes we need to look in the mirror to find the answer to what's wrong
with the current generation...
73 de Brian - N1URO
email: (see above)
Web: http://www.n1uro.net/
Ampr1: http://n1uro.ampr.org/
Ampr2: http://nos.n1uro.ampr.org
Linux Amateur Radio Services
axMail-Fax & URONode
http://uronode.sourceforge.net
http://axmail.sourceforge.net
AmprNet coordinator for:
Connecticut, Delaware, Maine,
Maryland, Massachusetts,
New Hampshire, Pennsylvania,
Rhode Island, and Vermont.
_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
1:56 a.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
I say that maybe to have the Coordinator Email address available (and not only his
callsign) in order that the Ham that need his coordination will be able to reach him
directly
But i still say that beside special cases the gateway user might be (and for my opinion
may get the option to ) able to register for himself Network and put on the DNS
Records for his gateway because he have the option to register a gateway already in the
portal so why not letting him to finish the job by himself ?
a person that know what he is doing can do all the process alone and a person that dont
know what to do will probably ask the coordinator help
Regards
Ronen - 4Z4ZQ
http://www.ronen.org
2:10 a.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
The reason is simple why not to allow automatic requests:
The coordinators may have a certain IP allocation scheme in there minds.
Maybe regional, maybe some other criteria.
That means that not every request out of the blue fits that scheme.
So an IP range may be unallocated, but it does not fit the allocation
scheme.
An coordinator would change the requested one allocate the right one, which
would not happen in an automated system.
e.g. in YO, I allocate IP ranges based on regions, so that the first number
in the block fits the requestors region number (the same as in the
callsign).
I had requests like "please allocate 44.182.35.xx to me", the user being in
region 8.
It resulted in allocating the first unused 44.182.8x.xx /24 subnet to him,
and not the original requested one.
This would not have been possible in an automated system.
Marius, YO2LOJ
2:05 p.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Why can't an automated system be tailored to particular allocation schemes?
Or have the policies for individual coordinators posted so that people
ask for the correct subnet the first time (and still reject requests
that don't match the pattern)?
Having a set of defined requirements from the existing coordinators
should make it possible to create automation that covers a large
percentage of the requests automatically, leaving the sticky situations
to be handled manually by the coordinators. Coordinators would still be
able (and encouraged!) to contact new users to help them with their
issues, but those that don't need the help would get running faster.
Win-win.
And yes, I'm willing to help produce the necessary automation.
Orchestrating automation is one of the facets of my day job. ;-)
- Richard, VE7CVS
On 1/13/16 11:10 PM, Marius Petrescu wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
The reason is simple why not to allow automatic requests:
The coordinators may have a certain IP allocation scheme in there
minds. Maybe regional, maybe some other criteria.
That means that not every request out of the blue fits that scheme.
So an IP range may be unallocated, but it does not fit the allocation
scheme.
An coordinator would change the requested one allocate the right one,
which would not happen in an automated system.
e.g. in YO, I allocate IP ranges based on regions, so that the first
number in the block fits the requestors region number (the same as in
the callsign).
I had requests like "please allocate 44.182.35.xx to me", the user
being in region 8.
It resulted in allocating the first unused 44.182.8x.xx /24 subnet to
him, and not the original requested one.
This would not have been possible in an automated system.
Marius, YO2LOJ
12 Jan
12 Jan
9:21 a.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
In Sweden we are in the process of establishing an Identity Provider
On 2016-01-10 10:46, Pedja YT9TP wrote:
(Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
_______________________________________________
On 10.1.2016. 03:11, Steve L wrote:
While using LOTW certificates is quite ingenious,
I think the whole
process to extract the keys will be a big hangup for the less
technical folks.
I could not agree more. Certificates are fine feature but very
cumbersome for people who are not game players.
And certificates expire after three years so everything has to be done
again, and guess what happens if one forgets to renew certificate.
It really needs to be as easy as possible, like how you can use you
facebook login (oauth token) to log into other sites.
Basically it your ARRL login should work like that, so you can login
to the ampr portal, qrz, etc.
This is actually good idea. Making login service could at least simplify
things as you have to deal with certificate at one place only.
This could even be service independent of ARRL, just using LOTW
certificates.
Pedja
YT9TP
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_________________________________________
44Net mailing list
44Net(a)hamradio.ucsd.edu
http://hamradio.ucsd.edu/mailman/listinfo/44net
.
9:36 a.m.
New subject: Verifying the identities of IP coordinators
Sorry, this message went away prematurely
Briefly, we are extending the national registry of licensed amateurs
with the same certificate-based identity provider (IdP) mechanisms that
are used by the universities to allow a single sign on to get access to
all what you are authorized to access. It also facilitates individual
authorization.
The services we are implementing include Internet Access via wifi-access
points set up in AMPRnet similar to what universities do in the
international research and education networks (Eduroam), the possibility
for owners of remotely controlled HF-stations to authorize colleagues to
use it, authorizing managers of UHF/VHF repeaters, providing access
control to documents, data sets etc.
On 2016-01-12 15:21, Bjorn Pehrson wrote:
In Sweden we are in the process of establishing an
Identity Provider
On 2016-01-10 10:46, Pedja YT9TP wrote:
> (Please trim inclusions from previous messages)
> _______________________________________________
>
>
>
3043
days inactive
3048
days old
38 comments
24 participants
participants (24)
-
Andy Brittain -
Bill Horne -
Bill Vodall -
Bjorn Pehrson -
Brian -
Brian Kantor -
Charles Hargrove -
Demetre - SV1UY -
Don Fanning -
Jerry Kutche (N9LYA) -
John Wiseman -
K7VE - John -
Luc Pernot -
Marc, LX1DUC -
Marius Petrescu -
Paul Lewis -
Pedja YT9TP -
R P -
Richard Chycoski -
Stacy -
Steve L -
Tom SP2L -
ve1jot -
VK4AA Sam