Sure I agree with that. But as it is, the portal is so far from what we need, and the move towards the goal has been so slow, that I think we must re-think what to do. It is all a hobby, but at times some people are very active developing some part of it, and it becomes a problem when other parts don't keep up with the needs and they are dependent on it. This afternoon I entered a lot of data in the HAMNET DB. (hamnetdb.net) That system is much more like what is required. I could easily enter existing subnet layouts and other definitions, because it does not have that strict "owner" model that the portal has. And it also allows to enter a lot more info. Of course it does not have the links to the tunnel gateway and RIP server, and some more info would be required for that (like defining gateway entries), but it is an opensource project and it might well be easier to extend it towards what we need than to continue developing the portal. Rob